wtf

[oatmeal_queen]

Why is it that most non-religious people i know are far more tolerant of other people's faith than the religious ones? (no, not all of them)
isn't it supposed to be the other way around?

i mean, most holy scripture, no matter the sect or base, preaches about this kinda tolerance shit all the time. did i miss something?

cause its good for me to be ok with the faith of people around me, but not good for the faithful to be ok with me.
Fuck. That.

normally, this kinda thing just rolls off my back and i ignore it, seeing as i have little faith in really old dead people to begin with; but hearing some surprisingly deep rooted hate from good people, just because they think it'll spare them from hell, irritates the shit out of me.

for fuck sake children, get along.

Comments

[sweill.livejournal.com]

Word.

I have to say, that while I usually have no use for the Lubavitcher-type evangelical Jews, they make me smile when they refer to folks who are not as observant as they are as "NFY" 'Not Frum YET' It's like they're okay with me 'cause they have -hope-. They're not just writing me off now and forever. If that makes any sense... =]

(Frum meaning really religiously observant)

[oatmeal-queen.livejournal.com]

see, now, that i like. it's like saying, 'yeah, we don't believe exactly the same thing, but we can still get along like human beings.'

why isn't there more of this? :(

[ciaranbochna.livejournal.com]

I honestly never cared what anyone else believed. If you aren't on a holy crusade, and you aren't trying to convert the masses, leave well enough alone. Would be lovely if everyone felt that way. I am more interested in studying religion at any rate:)

[ubermorte.livejournal.com]

I know many christians i can pleasantly discuss religion or anything else with, but unfortunately I know WAY too many people of the other persuasion.

I could, as you know spend a lot of time on this but i will simply say non religious people don't have an inherent need to convert, simple as that. Most are content to discuss differing points of view and walk away agreeing to disagree, and most religious feel a need to assert their self righteousness because they've been raised to feel justified in doing so.

It's a sad commentary on how people treat each other.

[oatmeal-queen.livejournal.com]

you know i have no qualms with your opinion on the matter X) as thats something we share, lol.

i was just unfortunate enough to find myself speaking to someone that i had otherwise known to be a tolerant person, only to realize just how intolerant they were.
to the point that i felt a bit insulted. and i -never- let something like that insult me. it was surprisingly frustrating, and stemmed completely from the fact that my views differed from theirs.
wars start over shit like that. kinda makes me ill.

[lunarei.livejournal.com]

Strangely enough, I've had the opposite experience. I always get athiests being assholes to me about religion. My favorite is when Willy was talking to his relatives about giving up something for Lent, and they all made fun of him.

"I'd just give up Lent for Lent, haha."

"Uh, how about if I give up Jesus for Lent? Does that count, Nina?"

I got a lot of that in high school, too. And strangely enough, by an old lady at my last job who liked complaining about religion despite everyone ignoring her.

[ubermorte.livejournal.com]

Unfortunately for a lot of people on both sides the experience is similar, Nina. Just like ever christian I run into isn't particularly well versed in their own doctrine or very capable of expressing themselves without resorting to scare tactics there are many ill informed atheists who are not very well read and bad at articulating ideas, and get defensive as well.

Regardless of what ideas one holds dear, we're all human, and humans sadly tend to screw up in this regard much the same way.

[darksilvercat.livejournal.com]

I think it's about even on both sides. I'm pagan and I'm so open-minded my brains might fall out, and though I attended a Christian boarding school, I had some fascinating discussions on religion with our reverend. The school's religious studies policy was one of absolute tolerance for any race, religion, gender or sexuality.

My little brother on the other hand is in a Catholic school (for the better education, you don't have to be Catholic to attend) and what little he's taught outside of Christian-centric studies is..... not hateful I suppose, but unpalatable to me.

My earliest memories and concepts of most religions are of the "one true religion" thing. You know, that belief that if a person doesn't believe what you believe, they're going straight to Hell. Some people reject that in favour of believing that good people go to Heaven, others approach anyone who disagrees as a sinner in need of either saving or condemning.

Therein lies the problem, there are many extremist believers who have done and said terrible things in the name of their religion and with the firm conviction that they are righteous. I once had one of those door-to-door evangelists saying terrible things about my pagan beliefs because she was attempting to save my soul from Satan. And we've all heard the bullshit spun by Christian's in America in defence of their attitudes towards gay marriage.

It's hit and miss I think. My brother and I were lucky to be raised in such a tolerant arena, but my littlest brother is stuck in a Catholic school where tolerance is pretty low on their agenda when trying to turn out good little Christian girls and boys.

But equally so, there are atheists who simply can't bring themselves to believe but accept and understand (and sometimes even envy) people who do have faith. And then there are those who convince themselves that people of faith are delusional, crazy or stuck in the Middle Ages, and enjoy a feeling of false intellectual superiority because they think they know better. I've had more than one atheist trying to tell me how stupid I am for believing in something that doesn't exist.

And of course the intolerant atheists tell tales of intolerant believers and how they are mocked or attacked for not believing, and the intolerant believers tell tales of the intolerant atheists who mock or attack them for their beliefs, and it becomes a vicious circle. Both sides are targeted for their beliefs or lack thereof, and both sides wind up hating each other more and more.

I was lucky in the way I was raised to approach religion and other issues, but I've been less fortunate in my experiences with peoples attitudes to me. As a pagan, the general response is one of skepticism and rudeness. It varies from the "oh that's nice" that is the equivalent of a pat on the head and the it's-just-a-phase look, to "so you think you can do ~magic~? Turn someone into a frog then. LOL YOU CAN'T BECAUSE YOU'RE JUST DELUSIONAL" and the accompanying attitude of superiority because clearly I must be both stupid and nuts to believe in magick. I get it far worse than most believers, and I get it from all sides because my beliefs are so different from the generally accepted norm for religious people.

Nevertheless, pagan practice teaches that everyone is free to choose what to believe. I would never try and force my faith on others, nor belittle others for beliefs I disagree with (unless we're talking about fundamentalist hardcore nuts who use their beliefs to spread hate. I have no problem ripping to shreds anyone who uses their faith, or lack thereof as a reason to hate others).



TL;DR - THERE'S SOME IN EVERY FAMILY.

[seraphitta.livejournal.com]

I get that with atheists tbh. And some are my friends.
I'm of the "believe what you want" school of thought, but it's becoming frustrating to walk around and talk to people who think that anyone believing in any God/entity/spiritual is somehow irrational and inferior to the rational soldiers of the scientific method.

Just sayin' it's the same on both sides.